Senate passes Sunshine Protection bill making Daylight Savings Time permanent

"Springing forward and falling back year after year only creates unnecessary confusion while harming Americans' health and our economy," Wyden said last year. "Making Daylight Saving permanent would give folks an hour back of sunshine during the winter months when we need it most."

https://www.cnet.com/culture/senate-unanimously-passes-bill-to-make-daylight-saving-time-permanent/

The bill hasn't yet been passed by the House. 


If we could pass this and a law for self-serve gas in New Jersey, all would be well.


They could also call it the "Dark As Hell On Winter Mornings" bill.


Too bad we can't just have a nationwide adjustment 30 minutes in one direction or the other. Split the baby.


The last time we tried this wasn't there a problem with little kids getting hit by cars while going to school in the dark?

Of course this would be a good excuse to make school days start later in the morning, as they should be.


drummerboy said:

The last time we tried this wasn't there a problem with little kids getting hit by cars while going to school in the dark?

Of course this would be a good excuse to make school days start later in the morning, as they should be.

Carter administration. Gas crisis. Sitting in line for hours to fill up. Yes, little kids got hit by cars, or at least that was the purported reason for ending year-round DST, as it was known then.


I was trying to run down the stats on children getting hit by cars during the gas crisis. I came up with a different point. Traffic fatalities seem to go up noticeably after the time change in the spring. 

https://www.healthline.com/health-news/daylight-saving-can-make-driving-less-safe


A reprint of a Washington Post article from January 8, 1974, titled "Daylight Time is Like Darkness Time."  I like the idea of  having an extra hour of daylight in the winter but can understand concerns about children's safety in the morning. 

https://www.washingtonian.com/2022/03/15/the-us-tried-permanent-daylight-saving-time-in-the-70s-people-hated-it/


mrincredible said:

I was trying to run down the stats on children getting hit by cars during the gas crisis. I came up with a different point. Traffic fatalities seem to go up noticeably after the time change in the spring. 

https://www.healthline.com/health-news/daylight-saving-can-make-driving-less-safe

yeah. not sure how much the kids getting hit is myth or not. I just remember it being in the news at the time.


PeterWick said:

Too bad we can't just have a nationwide adjustment 30 minutes in one direction or the other. Split the baby.

That's perfect. My go to solution for most of the negotiations I've been involved in. Meet them halfway.


cramer said:

A reprint of a Washington Post article from January 8, 1974, titled "Daylight Time is Like Darkness Time."  I like the idea of  having an extra hour of daylight in the winter but can understand concerns about children's safety in the morning. 

https://www.washingtonian.com/2022/03/15/the-us-tried-permanent-daylight-saving-time-in-the-70s-people-hated-it/

The traffic data in the article isn’t well sourced. It just mentions some accidents that happened after the change and doesn’t really offer an analysis comparing accident rates with other years. 


Morganna said:

PeterWick said:

Too bad we can't just have a nationwide adjustment 30 minutes in one direction or the other. Split the baby.

That's perfect. My go to solution for most of the negotiations I've been involved in. Meet them halfway.

Newfoundland -- We'll go half hour...


I remember walking to school in the dark in the winter in Ohio. I detested it.  I just looked it up — the first period bell at CHS will ring before sunrise from roughly Thanksgiving to Valentines Day.  Effectively we will be moving NJ to Atlantic time, and possibly into a different time zone than places like Ohio, which may not want 9 AM sunrises.  


Driving during rush hour in the winter when it's dark is also dangerous. 


I propose just getting rid of time altogether. It’s an artificial construct. 

Seriously though it’s hard to make a public safety case for or against the permanent shift to DST. School and work commuting are both affected by whether it’s light or dark out. And I’m not sure there’s enough data about traffic safety with year-round DST since we haven’t tried it for very long. 


Some interesting points in this article, which others in this thread have pointed out already.  

https://www.yahoo.com/news/permanent-daylight-saving-time-america-052453819.html

The U.S. is seriously considering making daylight saving time permanent, a move that would likely be popular. But history suggests that opinion might not last.

About three-quarters of Americans recently said they would prefer not switching back and forth between between standard and daylight saving time, a poll conducted in October 2021 from The Associated Press-NORC Center for Public Affairs Research found. Experts have lamented that changing the clocks has wide-ranging negative consequences, from sleep disruptions to a temporary uptick in traffic accidents.

Eighteen states have already moved to adopt DST year-round but cannot do so without congressional approval, Rep. Vern Buchanan of Florida said Tuesday.

And now the U.S. Senate has moved to do away with the bi-annual clock change.

But 48 years ago, the U.S. tried the same thing – and public opinion of the change quickly deteriorated, leading lawmakers to rapidly reverse course. The U.S. is set up for a similar rude awakening if it makes daylight saving time permanent, according to David Prerau, an expert and author on DST.


The government changing the time every year always seemed Orwellian to me.  I'm happy for this.  


sprout said:

Newfoundland -- We'll go half hour...

LOL I'm cool with being the crazy aunt! 


nohero said:

They could also call it the "Dark As Hell On Winter Mornings" bill.

Or we can have a dark as hell on winter evenings bill.

I'm pleased that we may be rid our our twice a year time shift.

As for the children, instead of al of society changing clocks because of elementary schools, try instead to  just change the clocks for schools. Have them start an hour later in winter. Or have schools start later during the whole year, like at 9am.


I find changing clocks an annoyance but not stressful. Yet, changing them seems to be a killer to some.

“The rate of heart attacks spikes by 24 [percent] in the days following ‘spring forward’ in March, according to a 2014 study from the University of Michigan. Another study, published in 2016, found stroke rates may also increase by eight percent,” the two wrote. “Year-round daylight saving time could also decrease the likelihood of fatal car accidents, which jump six percent in the days following the time change, according to a 2020 study from the University of Colorado.”

In one 2017 study from Denmark, scientists analyzed a psychiatric database of more than 185,000 people from 1995 to 2012. They found that the fall transition to standard time was associated with an 11 percent increase in depressive episodes, an effect that took 10 weeks to dissipate. The spring switch, by contrast, had no similar effect.


Can always count  on MOL for contrary opinions. This passed the Senate with not one objection from Rand Paul to Bernie Sanders.

I went to after school activities at the Y when I was a kid. Hated walking home at 5:00 PM in the dark


I’ve got it. Switch from having a summer vacation to winter vacation. Let the kids go home halfway through December and return to school at the beginning of March.


mrincredible said:

I’ve got it. Switch from having a summer vacation to winter vacation. Let the kids go home halfway through December and return to school at the beginning of March.

Which is more energy efficient, heating a school or cooling it?


mrincredible said:

I’ve got it. Switch from having a summer vacation to winter vacation. Let the kids go home halfway through December and return to school at the beginning of March.

but we need the kids available to work on the farms in the summer!

sheesh


Morganna said:

Which is more energy efficient, heating a school or cooling it?

you just set up solar panel banks on the top of every school. Then put split unit AC in each room, the kind that can also provide heat in cool weather.


I know one person in this household who would wholeheartedly support the elimination of the two time changes. Why? He knows that for the next week his lovely bride will be brain dead, cranky when sleep and meal patterns are disturbed, as well as generally confused, repeatedly asking "what time is it body time?".   question



mrincredible said:

you just set up solar panel banks on the top of every school. Then put split unit AC in each room, the kind that can also provide heat in cool weather.

Interesting. Expensive to do?


I say just stop DST entirely. Who needs sunlight at 8:30 pm? 


Morganna said:

Interesting. Expensive to do?

if I was seriously talking about this, I’d have to do a lot of number crunching to figure it out. There would be a large initial investment required, but ultimately it would probably be cheaper than continuing to use the antiquated heating systems are schools possess.


Jaytee said:

I say just stop DST entirely. Who needs sunlight at 8:30 pm? 

I do kind of think we should just pick one option and go with that. You don’t actually get any more hours of sunlight, it’s just shifting normal business and school hours to try to have a bit of daylight at the end of the day.


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